Had to supplement her $42,000 per year teacher salary with OF and made nearly $1 million in six months (almost 50 times as her salary) before the school caught wind of it and forced her to resign. Got a new job out of education and was fired five days later when they discovered news articles about her.

Edit: To those basically saying she had it coming because she made her OF account public…

  1. Sex work is real, valid work.
  2. There is nothing wrong with sex work. Sex-shaming is Puritanical horseshit.
  3. “But her students could find her OF!” is a problem their parents should have to solve. It is not her responsibility to use an alias, because of points 1 and 2.
  4. Every other argument criticizing her for her sex work during her non-teaching hours is fucking moot.
  • HulkSmashBurgers@reddthat.com
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    This all because US society views sex as something shameful, especially when it’s a woman being sexual. I think that all these anti-porn laws we’re seeing in the US is about controlling free speech, and controlling sexuality (women’s moreso than men’s)

    If what she’s doing on her own time isn’t illegal then employers should not be able to fire her for it.

    I guess the silver lining of all this is that she made a million bucks in six months. If she’s smart with her money and invests it she could set herself up for life after doing this for few years.

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      If what she is doing in her own time is against school policies, they better be paying her for that time too.

    • TurtleJoe@lemmy.world
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      US society sees a woman using her own body to make a bunch of money, and wants to cancel her. It’s not necessarily about being sexual, although that’s part of it.

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        US society sees a woman exercising self-empowerment as a reason to cancel her.

        It’s not necessarily about being sexual,l. It’s about subverting misogynistic, capitalistic patriarchy with the only totally exclusive resource she has.

        She’d have been shamed, imprisoned, ostracized, and burned as a witch in 1624.

        She’d have been shamed, imprisoned, and ostracized in 1724, 1824, and 1924.

        So, her being shamed and ostracized and her job loss in 2024 is viewed as “progress” in America.

        e: Yes, I admit, OF is another element of the patriarchy, servicing the male gaze and devaluing women to the level of exploiting women’s bodies. The system is what it is until it isn’t. America should be paying teachers more and celebrities — of all categories — less. Until then, this is the world we live in. The best that some of us can do is subvert the system.

    • octopus_ink@lemmy.ml
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      This all because US society views sex as something shameful, especially when it’s a woman being sexual. I think that all these anti-porn laws we’re seeing in the US is about controlling free speech, and controlling sexuality (women’s moreso than men’s)

      While I agree with this, it’s a subset of the wider issue which is why does your boss get to care what you do when you are not there doing what they have paid you to do.

    • AlpacaChariot@lemmy.world
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      Do you honestly think the school would have been cool with a male teacher doing this? I think it might actually have been worse…

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      Would you include protesting? What about protesting an abortion clinic? What about attending a MAGA rally? What if you found out a coworker was heavily involved in the KKK but never discussed it at work?

      I’m asking these questions because I entirely agree with you. Activities outside of work should have no influence on your treatment at work. This includes both things we support and things we do not support.

      Would you still agree?

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        I would. I consider the capitalists we’re forced to work for under threat of homelessness to be the primary cause of the emboldened cults of willfull ignorance you mentioned.

        They’ve been propagandizing us en masse since Reagan to reject evidence for their profit, stuff like “climate change is a hoax to sell books!” That led to a self-sustaining American proud ignorance they can no longer control.

        The MAGA people are the capitalist’s Frankenstein. The capitalists are more responsible for them than the poor gullible bastards are for themselves.

        And I can’t report them, as they own this fucking place and all of us. The MAGAts and freshly emboldened white supremacists are just side effects of Wall Street.

      • foo@programming.dev
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        Are you comparing a domestic terrorist organisation that regularly commits hate crimes to adult work?

          • foo@programming.dev
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            A domestic terrorist organisation with a history of racial violence isn’t “controversial” it is objectively terrible and putting both sex work and domestic terrorism on the same set of scales to be weighed against is totally fallacious and suggests that that you are not being a fair actor in this.

            As for maga, there are plenty of teachers out there who are maga, anti vax, religious conservatives, and other out there organisations who aren’t getting fired for their out of work connections.

            However if the teacher participated in insurrection or promoted their beliefs inside classrooms then it becomes a significant issue.

            Just like if someone is engaging in legal and consenting adult work at home what business is it or anybody else.

  • ladicius@lemmy.world
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    7 months ago

    Why look for a regular job? Continue OF for another year, retire with this fuck you money and do whatever you want.

    • steal_your_face@lemmy.ml
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      I think she’s just doing this for free promotion. Every article that’s written about her she probably gets tons of new subscribers.

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        If you follow the link another helpful commenter left, it’s pretty obvious she’s not interested in being an educator. She’s using the controversy to promote her dick-sucking videos.

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          I mean… for that salary and the work you must do, I am surprised anyone is interested in being a teacher.

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              She clearly chose to be born in a capitalist society, what a slut

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                  Nobody was talking about “getting rich” In some states you cant even live on a salary of a teacher and people are forced to work secondary or part time jobs. Of course, teaching is beter for sociaty than making videos for onlyfans, but I don’t blame her one bit.

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              You’re missing the forest for the trees. Teachers need to be paid more so that they can actually support themselves. Making derisive comments about people moving to other careers because they pay better is just attacking the wrong people. Making millions on OF is an extreme exception, but there are plenty of teachers who have left the education field to become a bartender or such, because teaching wasn’t paying them enough to afford rent and groceries. Teachers leaving the field are the victims of this, get mad at the system not at the people trying to survive.

              • SoleInvictus@lemmy.world
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                No, you don’t get it. Every single person needs to grab their bootstraps and pull so hard that everyone is promoted to management! Then we’ll all make management salaries. Having no employees left to manage, we’ll resort to managing each other.

                #upwardmobility #ownboss #yourboss #allboss

                /s

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                You’re making a huge leap here and assuming a lot

                I was simply saying it’s kind of a shitty thing to say “I’m surprised anyone wants to be a teacher”

                If I’m “attacking” anyone, it’s that person

                Not sure where you got that I’m attacking teachers… Never did at all.

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              How about: it’s a good thing, so we should properly compensate people willing to do it and do it well. This is a societal problem, not a her problem.

              Btw, putting the onus on the woman is something that misogynists would do, so you’re probably not really making any kind of point anyone would agree with except for maybe misogynists

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          Or maybe she’s falling back on her only option after she had to quit and got fired.

        • jj4211@lemmy.world
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          she’s not interested in being an educator.

          I think it’s probably better to say: " she’s not interested in being an educator anymore. "

          You are probably right now, but I’m willing to believe that she did at one point want to be an educator, but the financials didn’t work that way. Can’t blame her.

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        While I don’t think she should have been terminated from her role, I do wonder why this tactic seems to work so well.

        Many smaller news outlets (especially in the UK) regularly run stories about a young woman going through employment disputes, being dumped in some way, or going through something borderline newsworthy, and many times these women have a OF page they actively promote.

        I wonder if it’s just easy stories from people that want to be promoted?

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        I don’t want to dismiss the issue of people being fired for doing completely legal things, but I can’t help but agree, this always seems to be the case. I saw an article recently about a woman struggling with other parents and teachers at school because of the size of her breasts. Seemed sad enough and didn’t really understand why it was newsworthy, until I saw the mention of her OnlyFans and it all clicked haha.

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      “Not having to get up and go to a 9-to-5 has been tough on my mental health,” Coppage said.

      Sounds insane to me, but whatever, different strokes for different folks.

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        Most people need something to do. Being free all the time is rarely good for mental health.

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            Her skill was teaching kids, probably wanted to keep doing that for fulfillment despite the poor pay. But they wouldn’t let her.

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              If she gets financially stable from OnlyFans, she can probably find a way teach. There’s no need to rot just because your time is free.

                • owen@lemmy.ca
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                  Thanks for the reply. But this is not what I meant. She seems politically locked out of schools, not inable to find application forms.

                  I was thinking more along the lines of non-profits which are always looking for volunteers. She could even spearhead an advocacy group with her current influx of money and fame

                  One can dream

            • ASeriesOfPoorChoices@lemmy.world
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              teaching kids online pays as much or more.

              China was desperate for proper kids teachers to teach English and everything else (as opposed to the ESL teachers, or the “generic white people whose only skill was being born in North America”).

              She already has the equipment for it too.

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        I’m pretty sure my mates mum would die if she ever stopped working, she recently had to slow it down and give up one of her 10 jobs.

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        I have no idea how people like this exist.

        If it’s your own business or hobby then cool. But people out there feel the need to do some sort of basic job is crazy to me.

      • SoleInvictus@lemmy.world
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        … different strokes for different folks.

        According to her videos, she has mastered several different strokes.

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        It’s about structure and routine. A lot of people hospitalized for psych report issues with too much free time. And for a lot of people one of their only protective factors is a stable and satisfying professional life

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      Income isn’t stable and isn’t enough to be considered fuck you money.

      • NightAuthor@lemmy.world
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        A million in 6 months, I think if she could keep up near that for a couple of years, she could invest in something safe and live off of the gains.

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            Idunno, just didn’t do the math. I’ve definitely done it before and knew that at typical safe interest rates you can live comfortably off of the interest of…. Something in the realm of 1-10 million.

            • ASeriesOfPoorChoices@lemmy.world
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              you can live comfortably off of $50k USD/yr, which at a shitty 3% interest is $1.7million.

              But that’s my point. You don’t need more than $2million. The $3mil-$10mil in your range is crazy.

              This is why we shouldn’t just eat people with over 1000 million dollars, but even 50 million is an insane amount to need.

              • NightAuthor@lemmy.world
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                It was a vague statement, based off a vague memory, about some shit that doesn’t matter. Calm down.

                • ASeriesOfPoorChoices@lemmy.world
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                  yes, it was vague. And now you have been educated. You’re welcome.

                  CALM THE FUCK DOWN NOW. CHILL OUT. FOR FUCKS SAKE WHY WON’T YOU CALM THE FUCK DOWN?

                  Jeezus christ on a cracker, that’s how you sound, child. 🤦‍♂️

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    They claim that I violated their social media policy, but will not respond to me with how I violated it.

    WTH is social media policy? Is it written somewhere that employees can’t have OF? (And also who found her on OF and snitch on her?)

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      It’s probably some bullshit like “your social media presence cannot hurt the company” - i.e. if someone is a full on Nazi, clients could look them up and it being a controversy. But now it’s applied to OF by puritans.

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          You are equating hiring someone who makes and sells their own porn to hiring someone who subscribes to a hateful, violent ideology. They absolutely aren’t the fucking same. One is a legal adult legally providing a digital service to other legal adults, and the other is a member of a group known specifically for violence to advance racial superiority. Only one of those people does anything that could ever lead to another person being harmed or threatened, and as such only one of them should be driven out of society by any means necessary. This is not a “both sides” thing, this is discrimination against someone who has caused no harm, plain and simple.

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                  If you think they’re right to fire her for porn say they’re right for firing her for porn. Don’t say they’re right for firing her because nazis exist, that’s an excuse not a reason.

                  We have the technology to tell apart porn makers and nazis, we don’t need to treat them equally.

                • TimewornTraveler@lemm.ee
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                  Serious reading comprehension issue

                  Hi, new guy in the convo, dont point your guns at me, just wanted to point out the irony of you saying this after openly admitting you wouldn’t even read the other person’s comment in full

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              I’d say somewhere far beyond having a second job but not nearly as far as hate speech. If you’re confused about the concept I suggest you check out how labour laws in most developed nations.

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                You didn’t answer their question at all, just tried to dodge it by talking about labor laws lol.

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                  The only question there was where to draw the line, which I answered. Hate and other illegal stuff past the line, legal stuff not.

    • hightrix@lemmy.world
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      Nearly all white collar employees are covered by a social media policy. We have social media training annually and have to sign a document saying we agree to a number of rules on our public accounts.

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    Honestly who gives a fuck if people wanna make onlyfans pages. I live in America and y’all a bunch of closet prudes…we’re totally fine with violence in the open but any bit of sexuality and omg the Jesus republican nuts come out but separate church and state amiright# ? Lol. Here’s a thought…pay teachers significantly more and all school staff on that note.

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      I think if you’re a teacher, regardless of thinking if it’s right or bad, you’re asking to be bullied by kids for the rest of your life.

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        Then the problem is incompetent administration. “Kids attempting to bully teachers” is already a thing, and routes to deal with it exist.

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        She was already making way more doing OF than being a teacher. She still chose to be a teacher even though she didn’t have to. I trust that means she either already had ways of handling it or it didn’t bother her. Either way, that’s her decision to make, it shouldn’t impact her being fired.

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            Get over yourself. Even if they don’t do porn, the kids will make shit up about the ones they find attractive. Or are teachers not allowed to be attractive, either?

            There was a rumor at my high school that one of the math teachers used to pose for Playboy back in the day. Whether she did or not (I never found out, and who cares), she knew her shit and was a damn good teacher.

            Let people live. For crying out loud.

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            I’d welcome it. It is an opportunity to teach young adults about consent and how women are not sexual objects. What’s next? Your religion says not to drink alcohol and your teacher is a bartender after work. *Straight to jail.

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                When would you tell kids that women are not sexual objects? At the strip club? Is this pornography ?

                Because it was during Victorian times. And before photos they painted it. Pornography never was the problem. It’s sexual repression and the way men view women that is.

                For further reading: The sex work debate

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            That’s great. But there’s a shortage of teachers so maybe unless they start paying more to attract people that don’t have to resort to pornography, we should probably not put more restrictions on teachers, particularly if they are pointless puritan pearl clutching.

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          Being a porn star is not a sustainable careeer though. Not saying being a teacher is much of an alternative though.

    • CaptPretentious@lemmy.world
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      IMO, we NEED teachers. We DON’T need more porn. And a high school teacher doing porn seems like a conflict of interest. And frankly it’s not about prudes as much as some of these comments want it to be. This sort of optics exists for lots of jobs.

      If she wants to quit being a teacher to do porn, go for it. But, and I know this is going to be a wild concept for people, but you can’t get everything you want the way you want, i.e. “you can’t have your cake and eat it too”.

      • Maalus@lemmy.world
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        How are the two related? Why are you saying that it is a conflict of interest? It literally is about prudes, otherwise people wouldn’t give a shit and “optics” as you call it wouldn’t matter.

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          I get it you’re hot for teacher… Considering you put optics in quotes I’m going to guess you’re a kid yet. “As you call it”, fucking lol.

          If someone wants to do porn do porn. If someone wants to have a lot of casual relationships and private of their own home go for it. But if you’re going to sit there and act naive that teenagers don’t have access to the internet and don’t know what porn sites are and don’t talk… And you can’t figure out how that’s a conflict of interest… When you’re supposed to educate the kids. That’s a mental disconnect on your part, and everyone else at downloaded me that I can also assume that just wanted to see a naked teacher because fetish.

          • Maalus@lemmy.world
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            Try again weak troll. All you are worried about is “what would the people think?!” Which when you don’t care what people think about you, is not an issue at all. She’s there to do a job - teach people. Her also being a porn star doesn’t make her job any different, it makes prudes like you worry, because you can’t imagine a world in which someone doesn’t care about what people think about them.

            • CaptPretentious@lemmy.world
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              Try again weak troll

              So a troll in your mind is just someone that doesn’t agree with you… ok.

              You’re making a lot of wild assumptions, acting like you know me at all. You REALLY need me to be this mega-prude because that’s the only truth you know in your mind, it’s the only way your argument holds water. Gosh, would be weird if I said… she could do porn I wouldn’t care… but being doing porn AND being a teacher, probably not so much.

              You act like teenagers don’t go to porn sites. They do. You act like teenagers don’t talk. They do. Your acting like kids wouldn’t lie about their age and use their parents money to pay for crap online (porn or otherwise), they do. You’re acting like a class full of hormone fueled teenagers are going to be respectful and pay attention in class and not be disruptive… delusional. You seem to believe actions shouldn’t’ have consequences so long as you agree with it because it fits in your personal world view and everyone should just shut up and agree. Sorry, world doesn’t work like that.

              I don’t know how to help you. Honestly at this point, trying to show you how teacher selling porn is not ok… it’s like trying to argue with a Tumper that the election wasn’t stolen. Both of you have dug your heals in and only subscribe to your truth and everyone else, every reasonable argument be damned, and you lash out to anyone who doesn’t agree.

              So, I’m checking out of this pointless conversation with you.

              • Maalus@lemmy.world
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                Nah, you are a mega prude and don’t even see it. I said already - people who don’t care what people think about them don’t give two shits. If you think a class full of teenagers can’t “pay attention” because their teacher does porn, you are part of the problem. Otherwise, no attractive young teacher can teach, since “horny teenagers”. You know jack shit about teaching, about this topic. You just throw in your worthless 3 cents with a centuries old “would someone please think of the CHILDREN?”

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    “Not having to get up and go to a 9-to-5 has been tough on my mental health,” Coppage said.

    Oh, the humanity! That poor thing.

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        Then wake up that early anyway 🤷‍♂️
        No one is forcing her to sleep in while she’s not working.

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          I’m not talking about sleep, I’m just saying that a complete 180 in lifestyle is stressful. Whether it’s for the best is irrelevant.

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          She’s saying not having to be somewhere everyday that she’s proud of and where she helps children grow which brings her great meaning and purpose has been hard on her. Use your thinking cap.

        • TimewornTraveler@lemm.ee
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          Wake up that early and do what?

          Are you internally motivated in everything you do? You probably respond to a lot of external forces that structure your day too.

          If not, please share honestly because I want to learn more about your ways

        • owen@lemmy.ca
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          7 months ago

          It actually is hard, habit psychology has been thoroughly researched. However, once she stabilises she’ll be in a much better place than she was before.

              • nonailsleft@lemm.ee
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                7 months ago

                Could you explain why?

                Apparently she likes to work as a porn actress. This involves her having sex. More power to her but I think it’s weird we’re supposed to cheer her on but it’s totally inappropes to say out loud what it involves.

                • owen@lemmy.ca
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                  Comment 1: “ ‘Not having to get up and go to a 9-to-5 has been tough on my mental health,’ Coppage said. Oh, the humanity! That poor thing. "

                  [Small discussion on personal habits]

                  Comment 3: “She’ll be right in between two dudes pounding away if this news is correct”

                  Completely absurd^

        • BruceTwarzen@kbin.social
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          7 months ago

          Idk, i had friends who were in between jobs for a month or two and almost lost their minds. I had shingles for almost a month and had the time of my life.

          • tobogganablaze@lemmus.org
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            Yes, not being able to deal with bordom or entertain yourself can lead to mental problems.

            But that is not caused by getting fired or not finding a job. If anything it’s a problem that is masked by the having job.

            • abysmalpoptart@lemmy.world
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              I’m not entirely sure this is a fair take. Although i can understand where you’re coming from, i think it’s reasonable to consider that a decent number teachers (although certainly not all) are both passionate about their profession and also underpaid. This almost forces teachers to have a second job (side hustle) to enable them to continue teaching. The teacher in the article chose a less socially acceptable side hustle, but not an illegal one, and once found out, her employer activated a morality clause to fire her.

              From a purely monetary standpoint, she’s probably fine (assuming she continues her other job), but I’m not sure it’s reasonable to say that money is the only thing she cares about. Being fired from her (probable) passion of teaching sucks.

              Also, being unemployed sucks. It isn’t really about being bored so much as not feeling like you’re part of society. And for many, of course, it’s a financial hardship, but it can definitely be mentally taxing when feel like you don’t have a meaningful role in life or your community.

              There is also added social connotation. For example, meeting people, you often ask what you do. “I’m a teacher” will elicit significantly different responses than “i used to be a teacher” or “I’m an onlyfans model.” Whether or not any of us agree that it’s “ok” has no bearing on her future interactions and life. Labels like these matter to a lot of people, so i could definitely see how this would be mentally and emotionally taxing.

              • jj4211@lemmy.world
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                “I’m a teacher” will elicit significantly different responses than “i used to be a teacher” or “I’m an onlyfans model.”

                This sums up the key point. Being financially on good footing is a part of happy living, but being proud of your contribution to the world is another. This is not just because it’s taboo, but because it just doesn’t feel like it should be as valuable. I’d say the same problem could befall a firefighter turned corporate lawyer.

      • jj4211@lemmy.world
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        I don’t even know if it’s the habitual aspect that would weigh on you.

        I know folks that objectively have it easy, but are bothered by a lack of perceived “value” to society. That being a soulless middle management in some certain company does nothing that feels valuable, but you get crap tons of money. Then someone else who makes real changes in the lives of young folks, but society feels like keeping them around poverty level. Feeling both of those can weigh on someone with a conscious. I was doing something important and couldn’t eat, but now I can eat, but it makes no sense that this should be valued more.

        • owen@lemmy.ca
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          Listen, I was trying to limit my assumptions as much as possible. The main point of my comment is that a change in lifestyle has a transient negative effect on mental health

  • Poxlox@lemmy.world
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    Unpopular Lemmy opinion: A HIGH SCHOOL teacher shouldn’t be making easy to find, non-anonymous porn

  • Korne127@lemmy.world
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    It’s insane that this is just possible. That labour rights are so terrible you can just fire someone directly after employing them when they clearly stated what they are and were doing.

    • kyle@lemm.ee
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      I’d say so, at least sometimes. Imagine finding somewhat recent Facebook posts from a new hire and finding out they’re a Nazi, racist, etc. I’d still want grounds to fire them.

      Whether this situation applies? I don’t think so. Some company just doesn’t want to risk bad PR.

      • zbyte64@lemmy.blahaj.zone
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        7 months ago

        Bad PR because they don’t pay teachers enough or bad PR because sex work isn’t considered legitimate by some?

        • kyle@lemm.ee
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          Definitely the latter.

          Sex work in the US is still considered highly shameful, even as the amount of content grows every year and is clearly consumed by a ton of people in the US. Businesses don’t want to be associated with the taboo.

    • fidodo@lemmy.world
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      This happened in missouri, so I don’t think they give a fuck what they’re allowed to do.

  • VinnyDaCat@lemmy.world
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    Honestly, I’m all for privacy and your employer not doing this, but this is a strange situation. If I recall, on another post I saw she essentially made her OF very public as if she wanted someone to find out.

    Again, I support our teachers being paid enough to survive, and employers not invading your privacy and acting on your private life, but in this case she definitely stirred the situation up herself.

    Edit: For anyone confused, let me put it this way. This woman brings up an important issue, but I can’t sympathize with her specifically. She’s making an insane amount money, and she was privileged to be in a position where she could abuse the news/media for even more exposure. There are absolutely teachers out there in her situation who don’t have that advantage, who need both their regular job and their OnlyFans, and they likely lose what little sleep they’re getting in fear of being found out and losing one of their sources of income.

    Further edit: Discussed this with someone else for a bit, and I didn’t think of it, but if this blows up further, conservative parents are going to see this. You are going to have conservative parents up at schools, you’re going to have them in PTAs and other meetings, and they’re going to be demanding more privacy invasion in the form of increased background checks on teachers and other school staff. Schools are already struggling with staffing, and you’re going to potentially have people lose their jobs over it. Yeah, this lady is an asinine grifter for all of this.

    • FreddyDunningKruger@lemmy.ml
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      Why is everyone always so afraid of conservatives and their hypocritical positions? So what if conservative parents make demands against privacy? You know what happens then? You deny them. You fight for privacy. Showing them your belly is never a winning political position.

      • VinnyDaCat@lemmy.world
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        It’s not that simple. You can push back against them yes, but ultimately they exist in this world with us. You act like they’re not going to push back or fight and that it’s some sort of easy win.

        It’s ultimately easier to work around them and avoid fights when necessary.

  • JeffKerman1999@sopuli.xyz
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    I’m sorry she made 1 million dollars and that’s not enough for living? Invest it in something and live off the dividends

    • radicalautonomy@lemmy.worldOP
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      Or…and this is just a thought…maybe she uses some of that million dollars on a wrongful termination suit against the company that fired her, and then she’ll not only do whatever the fuck she wants with her own god damned body, she’ll do the same with the money as well.

  • Mr. Satan@monyet.cc
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    So my initial reaction was I wouldn’t want that teacher. Then I actually thought about it try to find valid arguments for my position and I found none. So here’s my opinion.

    There are two main issues here:

    1. Teachers are payed way too little for the work that they do;
    2. Sex (talk, work, etc.) still has a stigma associated with it.

    This whole situation is a symptom of that. I still think an employer has the right to choose the employees just as I get to choose my social circle. I wouldn’t want to be associated with Nazis or KKK. Similar reasoning can be applied to employers.

    Now is this situatios fair? Abslosutely no. Should this outcome be expected? Saldy, yes. Until there’s a major economic and societal shift in values, these things are to be expected and will happen again.

    • FreddyDunningKruger@lemmy.ml
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      Good on you for recognizing you were coming to conclusions based on your early conditioning/training. You should try to take it a little further. If you are going to make an enlightened decision about sex work, why go back to the puritan stone age by drawing comparisons to the Nazis or the KKK?

      Like when you say you believe an employer has the right to choose their employees, I doubt you are saying you believe an employer has the right to not hire certain minorities. Or that they don’t have to hire women if they don’t want to deal with being short-handed during a pregnancy, you see where this is going I’m sure.

      No shitty outcome should ever be expected.

      • Mr. Satan@monyet.cc
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        Well yes, I didn’t go in details or nuances. The line for me is whether or not the “group” in question is actively destructive.