SFMTA's train system in San Francisco is not only relying on humans to run it, but turns out that a floppy disk has been playing a key role for decades.
Sure computers had a hard drive, but it was the style at the time to remove them and use them as lifts in our shoes. You could tell who the poors were because they walked with a limp on account of only having one computer.
I’m trying to justify that in my head, but the only idea that I have is that “old” hard drives couldn’t handle the vibrations of a train. But flash existed even back then, and floppies aren’t exactly known for their high capacity.
Flash (NOVRAM or EEPROM as it was called at the time) did exit, but it was expensive, tiny capacity, and had astonishingly few write operations (compared to today) before it couldn’t be written to again. Some of the early stuff could be written (reprogrammed) as few as 1000 times and only had capacity of about 20KB.
An interesting thought, that the author of that article is younger than me, possibly like 5+ years younger. And I’m only a bit under 28. Scary how it ticks.
First several generations of hard drives really were awful and broke if you stared at them at them wrong. Floppies were more reliable, cheaper, and easy to get.
By 1998? No, hard drives were standard and reasonably reliable by then. Floppies were headed towards the end of their lifecycle with a high failure rate due to cutting costs.
I’m not sure what time you talk about, but it must be before 5,25" 20MB MFM drives and 30 MB RLL. Which were way more reliable than floppy disks and diskettes. These drives were available in the mid 80’s.
Incidentally 1986 was the year I got my first hard-drive. ;)
And yes they were absolutely expensive in the mid 80’s. The first 20MB MFM i bought was almost $1000 USD. This was in Europe, prices were probably lower in USA.
But I worked as manager for a computer shop, and the 4 years I worked in that, we only had 1 defect under warranty.
I remember it clearly, because it was a woman coming in with her computer saying her hard-drive was defect, most people being somewhat ignorant of computers, often called the whole computer hard-drive, and since defects were rare, I obviously thought she meant the computer. But no she actually knew what she was talking about, and she was the unlucky one to get the only defect hard-drive we ever delivered! OK my memory may not be perfect, there may have been others, but it certainly wasn’t considered a problem in general.
But I remember I heard about defects, very old Seagate drives could get stuck, if that happened, I was told you could tap them against the table flat down, and that would often resolve the issue!!!
Apart from that, I was much more confident with drives back then, because you could actually hear if they were going bad, as the drive would make a suspicious sound in its attempt to calibrate and reread, with a surface scan you could see if they were actually going bad, or it was just some unusual file operation. Generally in time to switch to another drive before actually losing any files. There may be some truth to drives being more unreliable back then, but they were (so to speak) more unreliable in a more reliable way.
Today this functionality is hidden in the SMART system, which I find unreliable. Drives reallocate bad blocks themselves keeping the user ignorant, until suddenly they are completely dead.
Maybe they meant home computers, and that’s all most of their audience will picture in their heads, anyway. But yeah, not a very good computer historian.
In 1990 I bought my first (very used PC) which had a 20MB hard drive in it. I In 1996 I upgraded my home computer to the largest consumer hard drive available 1.6GB.
For reference, a floppy disk pictured hold 1.44MB.
Aaaand that’s when I stopped reading. Please, we had hard-drives in average office systems for more than a decade at that point.
Sure computers had a hard drive, but it was the style at the time to remove them and use them as lifts in our shoes. You could tell who the poors were because they walked with a limp on account of only having one computer.
This comment has major Grampa Simpson vibes and I love it.
… we wore an onion on our hips, as was the fashion at the time…
Yeah they’re over a decade off from computers that didn’t come equipped with one by default.
I’m trying to justify that in my head, but the only idea that I have is that “old” hard drives couldn’t handle the vibrations of a train. But flash existed even back then, and floppies aren’t exactly known for their high capacity.
Flash (NOVRAM or EEPROM as it was called at the time) did exit, but it was expensive, tiny capacity, and had astonishingly few write operations (compared to today) before it couldn’t be written to again. Some of the early stuff could be written (reprogrammed) as few as 1000 times and only had capacity of about 20KB.
Haha, that was literally the exact same point I stopped reading. I have emails older than this system and they weren’t stored on floppys 😂
An interesting thought, that the author of that article is younger than me, possibly like 5+ years younger. And I’m only a bit under 28. Scary how it ticks.
First several generations of hard drives really were awful and broke if you stared at them at them wrong. Floppies were more reliable, cheaper, and easy to get.
By 1998? No, hard drives were standard and reasonably reliable by then. Floppies were headed towards the end of their lifecycle with a high failure rate due to cutting costs.
I’m not sure what time you talk about, but it must be before 5,25" 20MB MFM drives and 30 MB RLL. Which were way more reliable than floppy disks and diskettes. These drives were available in the mid 80’s.
https://www.reddit.com/r/vintagecomputing/comments/x98scz/the_original_20mb_mfm_hdd_died_in_my_286_recently/
Maybe you are mistaking a few bad blocks that were allocated out in the allocation table, for being unreliable?
HDDs before, say, 1986, were junk. Those that came after will still very expensive until the late 90s, when prices started to drop.
Incidentally 1986 was the year I got my first hard-drive. ;)
And yes they were absolutely expensive in the mid 80’s. The first 20MB MFM i bought was almost $1000 USD. This was in Europe, prices were probably lower in USA.
But I worked as manager for a computer shop, and the 4 years I worked in that, we only had 1 defect under warranty.
I remember it clearly, because it was a woman coming in with her computer saying her hard-drive was defect, most people being somewhat ignorant of computers, often called the whole computer hard-drive, and since defects were rare, I obviously thought she meant the computer. But no she actually knew what she was talking about, and she was the unlucky one to get the only defect hard-drive we ever delivered! OK my memory may not be perfect, there may have been others, but it certainly wasn’t considered a problem in general.
But I remember I heard about defects, very old Seagate drives could get stuck, if that happened, I was told you could tap them against the table flat down, and that would often resolve the issue!!!
Apart from that, I was much more confident with drives back then, because you could actually hear if they were going bad, as the drive would make a suspicious sound in its attempt to calibrate and reread, with a surface scan you could see if they were actually going bad, or it was just some unusual file operation. Generally in time to switch to another drive before actually losing any files. There may be some truth to drives being more unreliable back then, but they were (so to speak) more unreliable in a more reliable way.
Today this functionality is hidden in the SMART system, which I find unreliable. Drives reallocate bad blocks themselves keeping the user ignorant, until suddenly they are completely dead.
I agree with it being nice to be able to hear how they were doing. But it’s nice now to manage a thousand computers.
Maybe they meant home computers, and that’s all most of their audience will picture in their heads, anyway. But yeah, not a very good computer historian.
Home computers had hard drives by then. This was after Win95 was out.
In 1990 I bought my first (very used PC) which had a 20MB hard drive in it. I In 1996 I upgraded my home computer to the largest consumer hard drive available 1.6GB.
For reference, a floppy disk pictured hold 1.44MB.
We had hard drives in home computers there too.
Oh, 1998. My bad.