Summary
After a tense Oval Office encounter with Donald Trump and JD Vance, Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelenskyy received a warm UK welcome, including an official audience with King Charles at Sandringham.
British Prime Minister Keir Starmer convened a defence summit with European and NATO allies to reaffirm solidarity with Ukraine, discuss unlocking frozen Russian assets, and counter the rift caused by Trump’s accusations of Zelenskyy’s ingratitude.
European leaders fear the spat endangers Western unity and peace efforts and are vowing no negotiations on Ukraine without Ukrainian involvement.
That’s why they compromised trump.
Really tired of people saying “this is so bad for the US!”
Yea…no shit. That’s literally the whole point of all these insane actions.
And I’m also getting a little tired of them expecting me to be sad that this is bad for the US. A lot of the “woe is me, the US is losing influence!” Sounds almost as whiny to the non-American audience as some of the MAGA stuff about the world not being “grateful” enough for them.
The US’ international influence has been a mixed blessing for a long time. I’m kind of looking forward to seeing what Europe manages to put together as a replacement. Could be a step up.
Yeah, but this assumes that the EU will be able to get itself together and act. Right wing governments are on the rise and the biggest bloxk opposing them in the EU Parlament are the conservatives. Europe is not known for its fast and swift decision making. Everything takes ages over here.
I just don’t see the EU acting in union enoth to be able to face the challenges “stepping up” brings with it.
“Step up” are the exact words Europe needs to take to heart right now. Fuck the US. We’re the worst of everything everyone says about us and we don’t deserve a moment’s sympathy. I mean it’s been literally decades since the last time we pulled Europe’s security out of the fire for them. So show us what you can do without leaning on us.
A lot of the “oh noes the US is losing influence” comes twofold from:
General sinophobia as China is often seen as the next viable global superpower.
Americans who deep down know exactly how good they’ve had it because of that influence and are suddenly scared that their own country could become the true corrupt, broke shithole it has always really been. We only ever had wealth because we dominated and stole it from the rest of the world.
I’m with you, US losing influence isn’t a bad thing. It’s only bad for US citizens, who need to get a grip on how comfortable and coddled they have really been, even if they are poor. US poor is not international poor, once again, because we stole so much wealth from the rest of the world. I say this as a US citizen who is daily disgusted by the selfishness and coddled ass attitudes of his fellow Americans.
A good example of why is how we took the worlds outpouring of compassion after 9/11 and squandered the fuck out of it by playing world police and killing untold millions in the middle east and Europe has been dealing with the aftermath for 20 fucking years now.
The US has ordered the world for 70ish years, for better and worse. When that dominance topples, everyone will be rolling the dice on wherever comes next. China is poised to gain from that. Name your favorite Western European nation and it’s much more of a toss-up. China’s neighbors are more likely to come out as China’s vassals. Thinking only the US have benefitted from the US led world order post WW2 is hilariously naive. You talk a good game, ready to rush into a future without it, but you are leading with the chin.
I agree that lots of US folk are too complacent and miseducated to be useful, and many of our biggest wishes is just trying to get grown adults to have even a shred of responsibility for themselves and those around them.
I think people generally were a bit less useless until corporate influence pushed its hardest to culture-breed a dumber and more subservient consumer-employee type of human being, and was mostly successful.
Paywalling and undercutting education being a massive factor here.
But “sinophobia”? LOL! No.
Willing to bet most people , aside from the usual suspects, are just fine with Chinese people and culture.
Anyone with sense should be afraid of Pooh-bear’s CCP dominating global politics. A regime which tells the Chinese people what “their culture” is allowed to be, and forcibly injects itself into daily life.
Politically, judging by how they treated Hong Kong, and are currently treating (was gonna list but…dang that’s a list.) …every neighbor …yeah that would be bad news.
This country isn’t perfect, obviously. But I’d rather have the shred of a chance for us and other countries, that getting our shit together could change something for the better eventually.
You simply wouldn’t get that chance with China or Russia holding dominating influence.
As someone living in Asia, the US losing influence is a really scary thing. China has been increasing their aggression in the region and the US’s presence has always been the counter to that. It was a good balance but a weaker US will tip the balance to China’s favour. Not to mention that the US has been a key factor in getting Korea and Japan to work together on security matters. Unfortunately, there’s no EU or NATO equivalent for us to rely on.
I know its a daydream but this aussie would love to join the EU.
Maybe its time for an Eastern Union? IDK just thinking out loud.
Exactly. I’m an Indian and I’d rather prefer USA as global superpower than China.
As someone living in NATO area, I wish we would start NATO 2 without the US. They can effectively veto anything they want.
Time for a new collaboration.
Isn’t that what the EU is? What are the military aspects of being in the Union? I’ve only ever heard about the economic aspects.
Eu is primarily an economic cooperation Although there are ideas for a shared army.
Yeah, tell the Filipinos or Taiwanese that the US going down is a good thing. China is constantly testing both country’s sovereignty and waters.
I has maybe planned to retire to the Philippines with my wife, live out our days in her homeland. Now? Fuck.
I would say this is a good time for you guys to make one. My home country is Canada, and I think it’d be great to see defensive pacts in both the Atlantic and Pacific - we’d be keen on joining both of them, I suspect. We’re threatened by Chinese influence too.
As an eastern European who knows what it’s like to have an angry belligerent neighbour next door, I feel for you. I don’t have much to offer other than hoping you and yours continue to be ok, and hoping that nearby countries in similar situations can organize somewhat to help eachother.
It does raise the risk of the USA doing desperate and destructive things, like starting a world war.
Yeah, power slipping from a collapsing empire run by an autocrat is usually a recipe for a series of senseless disasters, and bad news for everyone involved.
Personally I think we still have way too much to lose for that to come from the US. And we could lose half of what we have and still have more to lose than anyone. WW3 is much more likely to come from Russia, who have already lost everything they have and mostly look around the world and see what they have to gain.
Well put, I keep trying to tell our local racist shitheads to direct their anger for violence by PTSD refugees at the American administrations, not at foreigners. You can imagine how well that is (not) going…
Very well said, and I echo the sentiment. Americans have been too comfortable their entire lives. Now, they may learn what it actually is to suffer and be poor.
Problem is, a lot of them already are suffering and poor. Look at the nightmare that is American health care, for example. They’re dead last among the developed world and people would rather risk death than call an ambulance because they fear it’ll put them and their next-of-kin into debt forever. Losing a job can mean death for some because their health insurance depends on employment.
And yet the propaganda reverberates back and forth among them; “The United States is the greatest country in the world! Land of the free and home of the brave!”
I’m Canadian, and Trump’s been Trumping a lot about how Canada should be forcibly made the “51st state.” He said, among other insane and offensive drivel, that Canadians would get better healthcare if that happened. I honestly think a lot of Americans believe that. They are deeply indoctrinated.
We’ve seen plenty of other countries where this kind of indoctrination works. People may live terrible lives of deprivation, but as long as they believe their enemies are worse off they love dear leader for the bounty they’ve been given.
Most Americans already know what this is like. But still they vote to make it worse.
So you think American poverty equates to levels of poverty seen in Africa?
Nothing does. The point is that America’s great “wealth” is not shared by most regular folks, the majority of whom are struggling to get by - albeit yes, with fucking sanitation.
That was not my original point, but go off.
Yeah it definitely sucked when the British Empire was dominant. But when their power declined, we had two world wars.
Hence why I said “I’m kind of looking forward to seeing what Europe manages to put together as a replacement.”
I get that it sounds whiney, and you are certainly entitled to whatever opinion you want. However, upsetting the balance of power will reverberate around the entire world, literally. Everyone will feel the influence of the new USA + Russia + North Korea axis… eventually. It has nothing to do with gratitude. imho at least.
That axis is “USA + two regional powers that can’t even invade a neighboring country properly and have negligible economies.” Not exactly an upgrade over the alliances the US had before.
Doesn’t that mean they care about the US?
If they care about themselves, the point is self enrichment. If self enrichment is the point and they don’t care about our country, the fact it is bad for the US is simply a tragic externality.
Maybe they’re stupid enough not to realize they’re doing permanent damage. The supporting evidence there that I can think of is that they themselves and their families are less safe. How will they spend their Bitcoin if things go south, will they enjoy living in Russia or China?